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Holly's blog: Robos, risks and returns

09/11/2018

Q3 Robo report - image 4.jpg (2)

Yesterday we published performance data for 9 of the major robo advisers over the last 12 months and 2 years. Although performance is the most juicy number we all want to see at the end of the day, I also want to drag ‘risk’ onto the table as well. Returns are all about where we get to. Risk is what the path looks like on the way.

Yesterday we published performance data for 9 of the major robo advisers. We’ve tracked how they have done over the last 12 months and 2 years (where available). And looked at how much risk they took to do this. You can get the full details and 'Meet the Robos', here. 

On average, the portfolios that contain the most shares, typically described as ‘higher risk’ portfolios, turned an investment of £5,000 into £5,353 in the 12 months to September 2018. For comparison, although by no means a perfect indicator, the FTSE 100 would have grown to a lesser £5,305. And the leading easy-access cash ISA £5,062. These numbers are after all investment charges.

Over a period of 2 years, for those robo advisers which have been operating for this long, the three best performers with higher risk portfolios were Nutmeg, evestor and True Potential.

 

Let’s talk about risk

Although performance is the most juicy number we all want to see at the end of the day, I do want to drag ‘risk’ onto the table as well. Returns are all about where we get to. Risk is what the path looks like on the way.

Investment gonks will talk about 'maximum drawdowns' to illustrate how bumpy a particular ride has been. It simply measures the difference between a high point and a low point. Let’s say an investment peaked at £10 one month, and reached rock bottom of £2 the following month. That would be a maximum inter-month drawdown of £8. (Stay with me folks!)

So let’s look at this picture below. This shows us how much these most punchy portfolios made over 12 months. What your £5,000 would have turned into. And what the most frightening month could have looked like on the way – what’s the maximum you would have lost if you’d bought at the top one month and sold at the bottom in a subsequent month? The main thing to observe in the chart below is that the FTSE 100 was the most volatile. And returned nearly the least. So all that risk you’re taking is a bit pointless, when you look at the returns.

Leave me alone, Holly, it’s Friday

Apologies. But if you get the above, then you understand the Nobel prize-winning "Modern Portfolio Theory" and pretty much everything you need to know about investing. (With apologies to Harry Markowitz who clearly added a few more complex nuances!)

Here’s why it matters. Even if you think robo advisers are a pile of unproven, new-fangled ****, look at your own investments. The vast majority of DIY investors have too much in the UK. And do not diversify well. This makes our journeys pointlessly bumpy. The main benefit I think the robos give us is a robust portfolio, crossing different geographies, investments and business types. This gives us a chance of higher returns, whilst keeping risk low.

However and wherever you invest, make sure you’re spreading the love around. Being promiscuous when investing is encouraged! This doesn’t mean you should go nuts and start choosing lots of different robos and platforms and ISA providers. Just make sure your investment provider of choice is supporting a good mix of investments under the bonnet. An analogy might be that you only need one shop. But choose a balanced range of products to put in your basket.

For those who don’t know what to pick, the robos offer a ready-meal to pop in your ISA basket. Check out what their customers have to say about them here. Or read our beginner’s guide to robo advisers here.

Have a great weekend everyone. Somewhat randomly, I have a new electric chainsaw to play with and a tree to fight. Is this my mid-life crisis, I wonder? The female equivalent of a yellow Porsche?

Oh well, at least it’s cheaper.

 

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Meet the Robos

Robo advisers are a way to invest for people who don’t give a hoot about the stock markets, want someone else to do it for them or for seasoned old dogs who can't be bothered with ongoing portfolio maintenance.

See how we analyse and compare the performance of 9 leading robo advisers which together represent over 80% of UK robo adviser assets today, in the 2 years leading to 30th September 2018.

Our Q3 Robo Performance Data

Leave a review

We continue to collect your reviews of investment services you use.

If you can, we’d love to get your opinion on the service you use – would you recommend it and how well are they doing? Helps others to choose, and helps us to call out the good, the bad and the ugly.

Please add your review here

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What should I do when the stock market crashes?

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Here Come the Ethical Robos (Ethbos?!)

Have you cut back on plastic since David Attenborough showed us pictures of turtles chewing on plastic bags? Or contemplated your carbon footprint since seeing pictures of the ice shelves melting? Chances are, it’s a yes. But have you contemplated making the ethical choices when it comes to investments?

Here Come the Ethical Robos (Ethbos?!)

Learn the Tribal Way

What are other people doing? Learn from their experiences.

If you know your shares from your SIPPs but could still use a few tips, you might be an Intrepid Investor. Take a look at our specialised Learning Path for an ISA MOT and some fund ideas.

Intrepid Investors

Related Questions

Got a Question?

  • I want to invest in one specific company’s shares. What’s the cheapest way to do this via an ISA?

    Peter | Lincolnshire | 21/05/2019 | 0

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Anna Sofat's Response

  • We have just retired to France. Our pensions cover our expenses but we also have £230k which we would like to invest for a monthly income. Could you please explain the low-risk options we might want to consider?

    Keith | France | 10/05/2019 | 2

    • Private Pension
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  • I have just received a letter from JP Morgan saying that they will no longer offer ISA accounts from the end of September 2019. I have an ISA with them and seem to have a choice of transferring the ISA to another company "as is" or liquidating and reinvesting. Any thoughts?

    David | Staffordshire | 09/05/2019 | 0

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Online Investment Platforms
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  • I'm a 30 year old woman earning a reasonable salary with a low cost lifestyle. I have saved almost £8,000 and want to start investing. I like the idea of using a robo-investor like Wealthify, but I'm not sure if it's better to start with a Stocks and Shares ISA instead? Should I go with a Stocks and Shares ISA or a Robo Advisor, or both?

    Kate | London | 29/04/2019 | 4

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
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  • I am a British/Irish citizen living in Malta and have between £5k-£10k to invest for 5 years. Clearly, ISAs are out as there is a requirement to be a UK resident. I am happy to accept a medium level of risk, and would appreciate some info on where to put this to maximise returns.

    Phil | Malta | 25/04/2019 | 4

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
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  • I've a Cash ISA with about £80k in it, so I'm considering moving £50k into a Stocks & Shares ISA. I'm 73, retired, married, a house-owner and would like to utilise my savings better. What would you recommend?

    Barry | Berkshire | 18/04/2019 | 1

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
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    • Online Investment Platforms
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  • I am a beginner investor and would like to invest in a "socially responsible" Stocks & Shares ISA. I have looked into the Nutmeg and Wealthify funds. Is there information about any other such providers on your website? And do you have any advice about how to compare the "socially responsible" criteria on the different funds?

    Joy | Glamorgan | 16/04/2019 | 1

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Robo Adviser
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  • I have two separate company pensions from previous employers. For the last 12 years I have not contributed to a pension. I am now 44 and know I need to put money into one. I'm not financially aware and the robo providers sound tempting but, obviously, I want the possibility for the best return at medium risk. Your Q2 2018 results update showed Nutmeg’s Portfolio 10 as returning different figures than the Best Buys page for Nutmeg says. Why are these figures so different? Is Vanguard Lifestrategy 60 a good choice, though they don't have a SIPP.

    Dave | West Yorkshire | 26/03/2019 | 0

    • Private Pension
    • Robo Adviser
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  • We have £100,000 in Premium Bonds to invest. We need it as serious illness has changed our lives completely. We have been advised to invest in a Capital Investment Bond, but fees seem high to me - 0.3% and 1.7% management and on-going advice. I'm considering Wealthify or other online funds. Can you help?

    Melanie | London | 25/03/2019 | 0

    • Online Investment Platforms
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    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I have had a Hargreaves Lansdown Stocks & Shares ISA for the past 2+ years, divided into their Portfolio Plus Balanced Growth and in a mixture of shares I selected myself. While I am happy to keep the shares element, I don’t feel the managed portfolio is working for me and I could do better elsewhere. Where would you suggest I could invest for a better return? I am happy with balanced and some element of high risk. I’m 47, have two primary school age children, & live in central London. I also have a mortgage and a workplace pension.

    Jennifer | London | 20/03/2019 | 0

    • Shares
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • For the last 9 months I've drip fed just over £10,000 into a Moneyfarm Investment ISA... it has been a very volatile year as you know. Moneyfarm seem to have done a good job of protecting my capital... however I haven't really made much in the way of gains... If I wanted, would I be able to transfer the whole lot to another platform where the fees are lower? I know you're not allowed to give regulated advice - but I'm uncertain if I should transfer the whole lot in one go, or drip feed.

    Robert | UK | 14/03/2019 | 3

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
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    Zara | West Midlands | 12/03/2019 | 0

    • Lifetime ISA
    • Cash
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  • I have about £100 monthly extra I want to invest, but I am not sure if my ISAs represent good value. I thought I could put the money in a higher risk investment, as it is money I can invest over 5-10 years, and had thought Nutmeg might be a good option as I have little investment experience. Am I right in thinking I can only contribute to one Stocks & Shares ISA at a time in my name? I could just put more money into my existing ISAs. What do you think?

    Colin | Lothian | 11/03/2019 | 0

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
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    Holly Mackay's Response

  • My 60 year old mum is not very financially literate and has has no private pension. She has approximately £900k to invest, from which she will need to draw down c.£40k a year for life. She is not very financially literate and would not be able to proactively manage the money herself. Would you favour an Independent Financial Adviser or a Robo Adviser for someone in her position? Thank you!

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    • Private Pension
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    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I am 47 and I would now like to open an investment ISA for growth for at least 10 years. I am tempted by the Vanguard LifeStrategy 80 due to the low fees and strong reputation. I would also consider investing in a couple of other Vanguard funds as well. Would this be advisable or relatively unnecessary, if I'm already investing in the LifeStrategy fund? I have also been looking with interest at Nutmeg, Wealthify, IG and AJ Bell Youinvest. Is there any provider that would stand above the others as most suitable in my circumstances?

    Matt | South Yorkshire | 11/03/2019 | 0

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
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    • Online Investment Platforms
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I’m 36 years old, earn £85k, and have about £40k savings in the bank, mainly in an old ISA that I’ve done nothing with. I have a five year old daughter and would like to put my savings somewhere clever so they start to do something useful by the time she starts at an independent secondary school and fees go through the roof. Any bright ideas please?

    Milly | Berkshire | 22/02/2019 | 2

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Junior ISA
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    • Online Investment Platforms
    Catherine Morgan's Response

  • Trying to get a bit more pro-active with my pension. If my money had been in an online managed fund like Nutmeg for example, is it reasonable to assume that as the markets fell last year the funds would have been managed in real(ish) time to limit the damage? If so, is it therefore a no-brainer to transfer my pension to an online managed pension or is it not quite as simple as that?

    David | London | 08/02/2019 | 2

    • Private Pension
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    Lesley James's Response

  • I recently came across your blog and it has been a great introduction to learning about my personal finances. I was wondering if you could recommend any additional resources (websites, books, online help) for beginners and that are tailored to the UK market. I am in my early 20's and I'm looking to further my knowledge of money, and foster a greater relationship with it. In addition to that, I'd like to know your opinions on how the possible outcomes of Brexit will affect the market and potential personal finance investments.

    Rita | London | 23/01/2019 | 0

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
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    Phoebe Smith's Response

  • With a SIPP in drawdown would a company like Netwealth whose investment management fees are of the order of .66% of the value of the portfolio, be a better option compared to companies like Hargreaves Lansdown or Investec? What are the relative benefits of Netwealth over the more traditional wealth managers?

    Steve | Lancashire | 22/01/2019 | 6

    • Private Pension
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    Helena Wardle's Response

  • Is there a Robo Investor who provides both income and growth for those who are retired? (There must be a large market for this?) It seems to me that at the moment all the Robos focus on long term growth and reinvesting dividends - which is fine if you are younger.

    David | 18/01/2019 | 1

    • Robo Adviser
    Dr Richard Bradley's Response

  • Hello, I really enjoy your website and find it useful and concise. My question is, what is meant by long term savings? I am 54, so what should I consider to be an appropriate time frame for any investment I make, that could supply the best results?

    Jennifer | Essex | 16/01/2019 | 9

    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    • Pension
    Anna Sofat's Response

  • I’m new to investing and in my late 30's. I'm actually stuck in a dilemma whether to invest using DIY platforms like Interactive Investor, A J Bell or Hargreaves Lansdown OR invest using robo advisors like Nutmeg, Moneyfarm or Pensionbee. I have compared the fees and they are not significantly different. Do robo advisers have a better return rate? I can dedicate some time to DIY investing but not a significant amount of time. Please advise. Thank you.

    Victor | Kent | 14/01/2019 | 1

    • Robo Adviser
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Phoebe Smith's Response

  • I’m a 20 something year old woman who’d like to learn more about investing. Do you have any books or reading material that gives a complete beginner a better understanding of how investing works?

    Precious | Surrey | 03/01/2019 | 0

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Phoebe Smith's Response

  • From my retirement I received a lump sum of money and a monthly pension. I have £100,000 that I do not need for the foreseeable future... One of my main concerns with Financial Advisers are their costs... All I want is simply to see this money grow to its potential, sensibly and above inflation... Therefore my next thoughts are Stocks and Shares ISAs... My only concerns here are the current Brexit problems - I saw the FTSE drop this past week. I cannot find any information out there to assist with my decision making if this is certainly a good time to invest... I am aware that I can place £20,000 for this year. Come April 2019 I place another £20,000 and so on until the £100,000 has been utilised. Do I have to place it into the same fund or can I choose another different fund with a different company?... Please can you help to ease some of this burden, which has proved an awful part of my retirement and made me frightened to spend any money.

    Katherine | Derbyshire | 02/01/2019 | 0

    • Private Pension
    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Cash
    • Robo Adviser
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Workplace Pension
    Helena Wardle's Response

  • I'm the sole carer for my chronically ill and elderly mum, as well as a full-time police officer. I have no other family apart from her. Due to mum's condition, and the fact that I'm exhausted performing both roles, the only option is to go part-time, as mum won't accept help from anyone else. To allow me to go part-time, I will need about £25,000 until March 2020 when I will be retiring. I’m confident of getting another job shortly thereafter. In January 2021, I will receive a commutation lump sum of about £50,000. I have a sizeable fund portfolio under an ISA wrapper with Hargreaves Lansdown. That is doing very well, so I don't really want to sell any of these funds and 'lend myself money' from that. My ideal funding solution would be a bond-type IOU agreement, where 'someone' lends me the money. Are you aware of a peer-to-peer site that could assist? Thanks

    Dave | Hertfordshire | 27/11/2018 | 1

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Other
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I’ve been investing in Nutmeg’s Risk 10 profile for three years which helped my deposit for my house. I am now wondering whether to use Nutmeg again, or should I use LifeStrategy for my £1000 per month? Is there a difference between Vanguard's LifeStrategy option and let’s say a well known robo adviser like Nutmeg? I am still a beginner and would like to keep things simple, but happy to take risk and prepared to leave my investments for a long time.

    Jordan | Surrey | 26/11/2018 | 8

    • Robo Adviser
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    Phoebe Smith's Response

  • Do you have any recommendations for books that I can buy my 18 year old daughter for Xmas on the subject of pensions and investments so she can start to understand the subjects? She's young I know but I would like to get her started. Many thanks!

    Nicki | Devon | 15/11/2018 | 2

    • Robo Adviser
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Other
    Catherine Morgan's Response

  • I was lucky enough to inherit a significant sum from my father... currently in Alliance trust platform in 10 investment trusts. They have delivered well in the last 20 years. But they are UK equity based. And highly risky. Do you offer a sanity check service for confused individuals like myself? I don’t know what to do...

    Paul | Berkshire | 12/11/2018 | 2

    • Private Pension
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I am 35 and working part time on a reasonable salary. I've recently taken out a Stocks & Shares ISA with Wealthify (from reading the recommendations on Boring Money) where I pay in £40 per month. However, I'm wondering if I should be doing more? Should I be diversifying and using more than just Wealthify? Or is it better to increase the amount into Wealthify?

    Holly | Sussex | 17/10/2018 | 1

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Lesley James's Response

  • I am 25 and starting to seriously financially plan out my future. I would really welcome a 'sense check' on my thinking as well as some help on which investment choices to make. My goals are: To invest for 15 years - my risk appetite is very high (i.e. I could afford to lose all my money). Goal 1 - More Important: To have an investment pot of £1,500,000. Goal 2 - Less Important: To be mortgage free. My plan is: 1) Open an annual Stocks and Shares ISA each of the next 15 years. 2) Open Share trading/dealing account. 3) Reduce my mortgage term to 6 years by 2025. I appreciate the above is a lot to go though, but I'd welcome any help and guidance.

    Mo | London | 15/10/2018 | 3

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Shares
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    • Other
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I shall have £10k to invest shortly, and I want to use an actively managed portfolio in a quality company. How would you rate - Investec Click & Invest/True Potential Investor/Nutmeg on the basis of ROI/customer relationship/quality/risk factors etc? I would class myself as a mid-grade risk-taker/reasonably adventurous if appropriate, with a high quality company. I presently use Hargreaves Lansdown and Wealthify but feel the need to diversify. What do you recommend?

    Richard | Shropshire | 03/10/2018 | 1

    • Online Investment Platforms
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • The recent Metro article which Holly participated in has really inspired me and made me think that investing in shares is something which I would like to do. Unfortunately I am completely thrown about where to start. I would be grateful for any advice you could pass my way. Realistically, I would only have about 2k to invest, so any tips would be gratefully received.

    Sarah-Jane | London | 12/09/2018 | 3

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Cash
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • Is there a reason you don’t list Saga in your Best Buys? Additionally, I have purchased a few investment trust shares but can’t work out how the dividends are paid. Scottish Mortgage is an example. I wasn't given an option to choose how to receive the dividends. It would be useful if you could provide some clarity on how investment trusts pay their dividends.

    Carl | Buckinghamshire | 07/09/2018 | 1

    • Shares
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • Can you advise me on the best approach when looking to invest in a product that offers compound interest? I’m thinking about funds rather than bank accounts. I also have 4 different pensions on the go. Should I keep them separate to diversify the risk? Or consolidate them? How will these pensions be treated when I retire? Will they be considered in aggregate by the tax man?

    Craig | Clackmannanshire | 16/08/2018 | 1

    • Private Pension
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    Helena Wardle's Response

  • I have about two thirds of my ISA in funds with Charles Stanley Direct and about one third left with St James's Place. I was planning to transfer the remaining one third to Charles Stanley Direct. However the recent platform price increases seem to put me in the worst position possible. I also have a private St James's Place pension. Would I be correct in thinking the fees are also high on this, and I could do better elsewhere? Can I transfer into an SIPP for example?

    Gerry | Bedfordshire | 15/08/2018 | 6

    • Private Pension
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I'm 24 and would like to begin investing. Am I better off using a robo advisor such as Wealthify/Wealthsimple or a fund such as Vanguard LifeStrategy?

    Amanda | Greater London | 06/08/2018 | 6

    • Shares
    • Robo Adviser
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I am 73 and cautious. There are two areas that your advice would be helpful..what if you just spend thousands on buying the gold standard footsie companies like shell and the rest and keep them for five years and then cash them in ?

    DB | UK | 24/07/2018 | 6

    • Robo Adviser
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    • Pension
    Holly's Response

  • Nutmeg require a minimum investment of £5,000. As I have less than £5,000 per annum income I am a bit confused about how much I can put into a pension. I know the government will only gross up a maximum of £2,880 per year but can I put more than this in and forgo the gross up?

    Barbara | HRT | 10/07/2018 | 1

    • Robo Adviser
    Richard Allum, MD, The Paraplanners's Response

  • We have a portfolio of ISAs/ PEPs worth around £250k, currently invested via Cofunds, managed by Chelsea and Bestinvest. I'm told this is quite an expensive option regarding platform charges. Are there better options?

    John | BRK | 08/05/2018 | 6

    • Robo Adviser
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Helena Wardle, Certified Financial Planner's Response

  • I am in the very lucky position of just having received a gift of £800k which I want to invest for our retirement. My husband and I are in our late 40s and aim to retire in around five years. We have 11 more years of school fees to fund, then hopefully university fees for two after that. I've put together a plan for us - can you have a look and see if it makes sense?

    Fiona | UK | 18/01/2018 | 6

    • Private Pension
    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Junior ISA
    • Shares
    • Cash
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I am already receiving a pension from a final salary scheme and I am retired. I have a sum of money I want to invest. Can I start another pension as a saver and, if so, how much can I put in every year?

    Collette | Greater London | 25/11/2017 | 0

    • Private Pension
    • Online Investment Platforms
    Danny Cox's Response

  • I am confused about index funds, e.g. Vanguard Equity fund. Do they track an index or include the yield? In the case of Vanguard, their low cost is attractive but their portfolio is made up of other Vanguard funds. I assume these probably each carry a fee structure - is this correct?

    Robin | Gloucestershire | 03/09/2018 | 0

    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    Mark Dampier's Response

  • I've got £20,000 from an endowment policy (astonishing, I know), and I'm looking into how best to invest to get a reasonable return without excessive risk. Any thoughts much appreciated!!

    Penny | Peterborough | 09/08/2018 | 1

    • Stocks and Shares ISA
    • Cash
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Life Insurance
    Danny Cox's Response

  • I am looking for a fund for myself (54 yrs old) but also my son (19 yrs old). Is this fund suitable for either of us with an investment strategy of 10 years +.

    | 29/05/2018 | 3

    • Robo Adviser
    • Funds
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I use H&L and although they are a bit 'plumy' on the phone I quite like their website and the costs are OK. So I was thinking of H&L for [my son]. I would be telling him to open these two funds and regularly invest and forget about them for 10 years!

    R | Greater London | 29/05/2018 | 1

    • Lifetime ISA
    • Robo Adviser
    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    Holly Mackay's Response

  • I have a bit of excess money to play around with and I have been looking at Investment funds. What is the typical % growth rate of an investment fund?

    David | Greater London | 07/09/2017 | 7

    • Online Investment Platforms
    • Funds
    Cherry Reynard's Response